Tower Hamlets Council has been rightly praised by the likes of Stonewall for its gay-friendly workplace policies. However, the council is not the borough.
The area around Spitalfields and the Shoreditch boundary is home to a growing and vibrant gay scene, but there is also a dark side. According to figures from the Met Police, a homophobic crime is committed in Tower Hamlets at the rate of more than five a month. I suspect the true level is much higher.
The gay community around Brick Lane frequently worry about being abused or attacked. Some of that abuse comes from idiots handing out leaflets outside the Whitechapel Idea Store or the East London Mosque (the mosque itself condemns such actions).
And today, this poster has just sprouted around the Hanbury Street area of Spitalfields and Whitechapel.
A friend spotted one on the entrance to the Brady Centre and several more on lampposts and other street furniture along Hanbury Street. One was also on the door of Davenant House on the Chicksand estate.
The posters say “Arise and Warn” at the top and declare the neighborhood a “gay free zone”.
Sinisterly, they say if not, “fear Allah” and risk punishment.
He removed most of them and is reporting them to the police.
He’s also worried; he didn’t want me to publish his name for obvious reasons, but said: “It’s very serious and really worrying for us. There are lot of gay men and women who live around here.
“It’s another sign that extremism has not gone away.”
If anybody sees any more of these posters, do please let me know.
UPDATE: Sunday, Feb 13. 3pm
I’m being told that more of these posters appeared this morning outside Swanlea School in Brady Street, Whitechapel. They’ve also now been removed.
UPDATE: Monday, Feb 14th – 8.30pm
The Association of British Muslims has now condemned these leaflets and has asked Peter Tatchell to intervene.
You should add a tweet button to your blog.
Thanks for alerting us to this Ted. But as for two of the comments – what a pathetic pair of sneering slack-jawed whingers! I can’t believe what I’m reading!!! Blimey, now I know who will walk on the other side if I ever get done over by homophobes inspired by the Islamic equivalent of the BNP. And if you are openly muslim and LTGB in Tower Hamlets you’re in more danger than most. I’ve had scary homophobic death threats from the ex-Islam4uk gang here and I can tell you they’ve been specifically targeting their message at young muslims in Tower Hamlets with some success. I’ve heard them. I know them. I know precisely how they operate. I know some of the converts. And I know how attractive their perversion of Islam can be, especially when it comes to sexuality. The latest sticker attack is just the tip of a dangerous iceberg. But this is also very much a specific Tower Hamlets cultural issue and the majority muslim community here is very much aware of it too. And there are loads of good progressive muslims in the borough and in the mosques and schools and community centres who are quietly doing brilliant work diverting the loud-mouthed ideologs of hate’s fight for young hearts and minds. But lone nutters these ideologs most certainly are not. So take them at their word – and take them seriously. East End Gay Man and Kevin come across as a couple of blase know-alls. They should open their own hearts and minds, put their petty prejudices aside and join people of all backgrounds – even Sunday Express employees – in exposing and combatting hate-mongering jihadis wherever they turn up on our streets, rather than trying to score points in the unreal world of the blogosphere. Ironically, if anyone ever does get attacked in Hanbury Street by someone influenced by an Islamist homophobic slogan on a sticker, it looks as if it’s the decent local ‘straight’ muslims who are more likely to come to their aid rather than shoulder-shrugging East End Gay Man and Kevin. Learn and get real boys.
What do statistics tell us? To at least provide some perspective and context to the homophobic incidents in Towerhamlets, it might be useful to compare these figures with other neighbouring boroughs.
Metropolitan police data is for Dec 2010
Westminster: 142
Lambeth: 126
Islington: 132
Camden: 90
Southwark: 78
Tower Hamlets: 67
Hackney: 66
Wandworth: 53
Lewisham: 32
Newham: 26
There’s a very clear correlation here.
The areas with the highest tourist traffic have the most attacks, those with the lowest have the least.
Axel,
Very well spotted. It’s insightful analysis like yours rather than the sensationalist media reporting that sometimes happens that helps us to understand issues better.
It amuses me you are suddenly interested in gay rights given you write for one of the most homophobic papers in Fleet Street.
The problem you mention has been an issue for years and has resulted in one person suffering brain damage as a result of an attack. This is not a specific Tower Hamlets problem as these stickers have also appeared in Islington.
These flyers/stickers have been around for a long time – see http://nottingham.indymedia.org.uk/articles/197
There are lone oddball nutters with nothing better to do with their time in every part of the country – isn’t your headline rather alarmist, or is there any evidence of a concerted campaign against the LGBT community in Tower Hamlets?
It is at least reassuring to know that the reported numbers of incidents have fallen compared to the previous year, from 73 to 67. However, Racist and religious hate crime is disturbingly high at 345 incidents for the last year.
Kevin is right, these banners have been around for a while (there were ones in Stoke Newington several months ago). However, he is wrong to downplay what is going on. Delwar Hussain wrote a good article on this subject quite a while ago http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/aug/24/gay-hate-tower-hamlets
Steve,
I would be glad to know where you got your figures from as I want to do some research on this subject. Was it from the Community Safety Unit?
Essexlad, the figures are from the same source that Ted points to in his blog, but for your ease this is the full url to the link:
http://www.met.police.uk/crimefigures/datatable.php?borough=ht&period=year
It would be good if you could post your findings once you have completed it. It would be interesting to know what the ethnicity and religion of both the victims and perpetrators are, but unfortunately this is not disclosed by the police.
Suse,
Thank you for posting this link. Whilst the published figures are much to be desired in terms of accuracy, particularly for 2007 onwards, nonetheless the picture that emerges is that not anyone racial group is more likely to be victims or perpatrators, in fact the profiles are not too disimilar from the projected demography of the borough.
The primary driver for attacking so-called “gay” people in Tower Hamlets is not homophobia it is actually racism; these are actually attacks on British society as a whole and its tolerance of diversity rather than on gay people per se.
This over simplified justification that it is Muslims attacking gay men suits both the protagonists (who struggle to justify their animosity to the world they live in) and the police (who invariably like to do as little as possible). It is racism not homophobia that is the driving force behind these attacks; gay men are just an easy and convenient target.
The boldness of this “gay free zone” campaign is astonishing and sickening but attacks on gay people are actually the norm around here which is probably why this has become so brazen.
I know of literally dozens of violent and menacing instances of people I know who have been attacked by angry young men who presumed – often falsely – that they were gay. Sadly, these attacks almost all come from the Bangladeshi Community and are committed almost always against young white men.
A really disturbing facet of this is that these are actually racially motivated attacks that are being falsely labelled as homophobic attacks by both the attackers and the police because homophobia is far more acceptable among their own community and for the police homophobia is far more manageable than racism.
The attackers justify to their peers certain attacks on young, white men on the basis the victim “was probably gay”. However, being gay had nothing to do with it. In the eyes of many attackers the behaviour of young white men and the latest fashions appear “gay” and therefore they “must” be gay. The attackers do not actually know the sexuality of their victims but appear to attack them as an expression of a general hostility to the “decadent” and multi faceted British culture they don’t feel truly a part of. Assaulting gay men is far less problematic to justify among their peers – who is going to defend them? This wrong labelling suits the Police too who don’t want to acknowledge the levels of racism in the borough between young men in different communities and would much rather pigeon hole such attacks simply as “homophobia” and then close the file.
What utter bollocks. I’ve faced homophobic abuse – and I’m not white. I’ve faced it from Bangladeshi youth and from “young, white men”.
It’s nothing to do with racism. It’s to do with homophobia.
How many of these homophobes have you spoken to, in order to reach the conclusion that “these are actually attacks on British society as a whole and its tolerance of diversity rather than on gay people per se”?
I can take a guess: none.
No one will deny that there’s a problem of homophobia in Tower Hamlets – they’d be naive to make such claim. However, you paint it as though it’s some sort of race war – when my own experiences and the experiences of my friends – gay and straight, of many different ethnicities – suggest otherwise.
Homophobic attacks (verbal and/or physical) tend to come from young people – in a borough where the vast majority of young people (<25yo) are Bangladeshi (75% I think), statistically, chances are the perpetrator will be Bangladeshi. Additionally, LGBT people from an ethnic minority are more likely to be closeted – therefore less likely to be targets of homophobic abuse. Statistically, they'll be under-represented amongst the victims of such attacks. Therefore, looking at cold hard statistics, the likelihood is that victims of such attacked will be white.
That kind of blows your theory of a race war out of the picture… What it suggests is that there are homophobes all over the place. Some also (as expected) happen to be Bangladeshi.
If you're James Folgate from the TH Labour Party, I'm deeply deeply disappointed. I expected so much better from someone who is part of the labour movement.
I am sorry but I think I may have been a little misunderstood. It is my fault for not reading through what I was writing before posting and not ensuring what I was trying to say was clear enough. I apologise.
The point I was trying to make is that there is more to this sort of homophobia than white on white homophobia. There is a background religious superstructure that can be misused to justify such attacks which I think the recent posters illustrate.
I have personally witnessed half a dozen violent attacks on people over the past twelve years I have lived in Spitalfields and while many of the victims actually were gay men around half are not but were accused of being gay before they were attacked.
I accept your point about most young people living around these parts being of Bangladeshi but that doesn’t take into account the many visitors who are often the target of random assaults.
There is a clash of cultures element to this which I don’t think can be denied and I think this conclusion is something the recent posters demonstrate. If there are more homophobic assaults around Tower Hamlets than there are in other parts of London then I think that would only serve to prove my point.
There isn’t “more to this sort of homophobia than white on white homophobia.” Homophobia is homophobia.
What you have is a group of, usually young men – statistically Bangladeshi – who attack people they perceive to be “different”, in this case, gay.
Yes, sometime religion/belief is used to justify it. Sometimes it’s Islam, others have used Christianity, some atheists have declared it’s unnatural and used that as a basis for assault. Often it’s just an act of violence for the sake of it and homophobia is the expression of that violence, often fuelled by drugs. That by no means excuses it. But it’s just not as simple as you’d like it to be.
While there is no excuse for it, you can study the reasons why it happens. Graham Taylor makes some good points in response to comment 13.
Whether the victim of the abuse/assault is gay or not is irrelevant in considering whether or not the attack itself is homophobic. Did the perp think they were gay and attack them as a result? If so, it’s homophobic.
I’m not sure if your fourth para makes sense. What I said doesn’t exclude visitors being victims of homophobic assaults.
Look at the statistics on homphobic assaults that Steve has posted in response to comment number one for the answer to the last point you make.
@James Folgate
That doesn’t make sense at all. If racism is the motivation, why are they picking on people they perceive to be gay?
When I was hit over the back of the head with a brick by some white guy in Hampshire, was that an expression of his hostility to decadent British culture? Of course not!
The Allah references clearly point to this being motivated in part by the array of extremist preachers spewing their filth about the place.
@Steve
It’s not a competition for victimhood. Racist attacks don’t excuse or explain homophobic ones.
And neither did I say it was!
Fair point!
Thanks Ted for the alarming story, of course you knew about this for some time, but timing of it is suspect. Can you some how please link the attacks to Lutfur? I mean could the angle be it has increased since he has become mayor?
Remember, it’s ‘Lutfur on Trial’ and that’s the angle you should always be coming from. Of course you won’t mention the fact that Tower Hamlets is one or the ‘gay friendly’ boroughs to work in, or the fact that Lutfur supported a gay pride march through Victoria park. Nope, that would be boring
I think you should practise your reading skills a bit more.
To be fair Ted it’s a bit difficult practicing on your blog because of the innuendos and insincerity at times
Your headline
‘extremists declare Tower Hamlets a gayfree zone’
Let’s agree on some points:
Attacks are wrong
But to say that a handful of people who probably do not represent 0.5% of the local Muslim community, as declaring the whole of Tower Hamlets gay free is preposterous. They are probably a handful of idiots, but to use such emotive and sensational languge, has only one purpose and that is to link it to Lutfur and probably the vast majority of Muslims.
When you’ve practised reading, take a long lie down in a dark room. Concocting conspiracies is doing you no good. There is no link whatsoever to Lutfur.
Anon 1,
What are you on about? It is certain that most ravist attacks in TH are now Bangladeshi on others and not just white. African Caribbeans are being assaulted.
Could you actually think about what you have said and get back to us?
You need to go back and re-read what I’ve written. Read it twice if it helps.
James – what utter bollocks. It doesn’t matter what the victim’s sexuality is. It’s still hompohobic hate crime if the attacker thinks they’re gay.
Ted – only a Sunday Express hack could stir up racism in Tower Hamlets by writing a story about a handful of nutters sticking up posters that are rightly taken down again by the Council. The big story would be if the council didn’t take thenm down.
Graham, it wasn’t the council which took them down (although I’m sure it would if its workers had seen them).
Graham – I totally accept your point that if the attacker thinks they’re gay (even when they’re not) then it is still a homophobic hate crime. But what I am trying to say is that in some cases the crime is wrongly labelled as a homophobic attack when actually the primary motivating factor for the attack is not the person perceived sexuality but their cultural background. If a group of people believe that most white men are gay and attack white men accordingly does that make it a racist attack or a homophobic attack?
Jamesmate – with the greatest of respect – that’s still nonsense. Particularly “while many of the victims actually were gay men around half are not but were accused of being gay before they were attacked” (a) how do you know whether they were gay or not? (b)I think that rather prooves the point – they attacked them because they though they were gay.
“If a group of people believe that most white men are gay”
Really? You think these people think that most white men are gay? What planet are you living on?
The big story should be, Graham Taylor, is that the group that was under attack prior to Gays was the Jewish one when ” kill the Jews” was painted on the sides of the footbal pitch in Heneage St just off Brick Lane.
I posted about this at the time elsewhere, and arranged for anti-semitic graffiti elsewher in the borough to be removed overnight. (Also not forgetting the smashed windows at Starbucks – perceived to be a Zionist organistaion).
However that was during a period where Palestinians were under attack from Israel – and tension were heightened – and since then we’ve not seen a repeat of that. Homophobic attacks have been on the rise since before that.
I think there are a number of factors at play here. There is certainly an intolerance of Gays in Islam which ranges from dislike to a Desire to kill and in some countries of course that happens.
What has also happened is that many Bangladeshi youths have adopted an American gangster rap persona which can be seen anywhere in the East End from Brick Lane to Cannon St Rd and out to Poplar.
Inherent in this is a contempt/ hatred of gays a fact which is obvious in the music, the lyrics of some songs have got the singers banned from this country on the grounds that they are incitement to murder.
It really is an education to walk around the areas I have mentioned and watch how a popular but utterly negative culture has, in a relatively short space of time, embedded itself amongst a section of young Bangladeshi males.
The clothes, attitude and jargon are pure Compton, Watts and any black inner area of this country. Allied to this is one of the highest unemployment rates in the country and, if the local paper and by this I mean the ELA not the council free sheet, is to be believed, a massive drug taking and selling problem.
There is a generation of young Bangladeshi males who are now caught up in not just an anti gay ethos but an anti white and anti western one mixing a dangerous cocktail of the anti western values of Islamism with the intolerance of gangster rap.
I agree with your analysis about the influnece of ‘gangsta rap’ – and think this is far more damaging than any religion (very few of which have much positive to say about homosexuality).
I’m involved with some schools/youth work and drugs are an issue (and go hand-in-hand with the desperation of unemployment) but the vast majority of teenagers in Tower Hamlets want to get a decent education and succeed in life. I’m constantly amazed by their attitude and the hard work and dedication of teachers and youth workers in TH – all of which of course is being put in jeopardy by the Tory led government.
At a school I’m involved in – where the majority of pupils are Bangladeshi boys – we recently had Sir Ian Mackellan speak about homophobia; and he got a perfectly good, very mature, reception.
“There is certainly an intolerance of Gays in Islam which ranges from dislike to a Desire to kill and in some countries of course that happens.”
If we were to talk about the attitudes towards gays in Islam (rather than the use of the word intolerance which reveals your inherent bias) we will see a somewhat wider range: from embracing LGBT people all the way to the murders… How is that any different from Christianity?
I’m pleased that the AoBM have condemned the posters. Recently the far right have suddenly decided they love the gays so they can use alleged Muslim homophobia as a stick to beat Muslims with, so it’s nice to see an islamic organisation stating that they’re against the message of these posters. You’d hope people would have got the message that very few Muslims were into this kind of extremism, but it seems it bares repeating.
Some people seem to think local gays are under some kind of siege from marauding young Muslims, but that really isn’t the case. In my experience, attitudes to homosexuality among Muslims mostly range from not caring either way to trying to pick me up in the case of one of the lads hanging about in our stairs.
That’s not to say I don’t think we should be scared to confront these issues for fear of stirring up racial tensions, because that way people like the AoBM are left to deal with such issues without any help from anyone else.
There are sometimes issues around acceptance of homosexuality among Muslims. A gay Muslim friend of mine was looking for a lesbian Muslim to sham marry, such was the pressure from his parents. And if we don’t try to change attitudes, then we don’t afford the same rights to gay south Asian people that we do to gay white people, which would surely be the more racist thing.
I found a small sticker version of it on the ticket machine at Heron Quays DLR station this morning, inside Canary Wharf. I tore it off and handed it to a policeman. This does need to stop.
Please make sure you report it properly, CCTV will be better around DLR stations. More chance of catching the perp/s.
James the boys you describe whom go around behavign like thugs are east london boys growing up in a harsh urban culture, it has nothing to do with ‘Asian ness or colour in fact they are far from any roots theyl ever know, empyty vacums or lost souls, whom have lost connections with their asian culture/ families/religion as they have with any englishness they can relate to’. Asian men in Bangladesh openly holds hands together and walk, as it is seen as normal behaviour.
These boys behaviour are disgusting but if you look youl find If it has nothing do with religion or asian culture, the first genereatio asians/muslims whom arrived in the UK in 60s and 70s, were the ones who set up mosques, islamic schools, and were more religious in nature and closer to their culture, did you hear of any asians behaving liek thugs or beatin up ‘gays’ or anyone else? These thinsg didnt happen except amongst the NFs. You are talkign about third genreation boys whom are far from their roots or religion but consumed by the urban street culture of our country.
At a time the muslim community is fighting islamaphobia in the media, amongst politicians, amogst work place and everywher…e those within that community need to stand up and condemn thses kind of disgusting homophobic acts. I live in tower Hamlet and am very active in the community, and have rarely heard any one condone any of these behaviour.
I feel like the EDL and BNP there will always be small numbers of peopel whom want to create disturbances in our community. I really feel there are peopel whom are doign this deliberatley to create problems, i’m always in and around East london mosque as i work close by and dine out there alot and have never seen any such behaviour there.
There have been eerie posters of all sorts flying around in Tower Hamlet, there was one at Xmas saying horrible things but when they tried to trace the organisation and number it didn’t exist, it was anonymous. Someone is deliberately creating problem.To blame the council or Lutfur suggest to me something even more eerie going on…i want to know who is behind this and why they are doing this in last 6 months. Tower Hamlet has huge numbers of people coming in and out, last year wev’e had huge numbers of foreign students, it has a massive night life of all sorts of people coming and going. Please put your prejudice to one side and see things rationally and in porporion.
There was a bombing incident in soho near gay nightclub years ago did we blame the leader of the council for that? Or the churches close by? There is always an air of racism and islamphobia around the way these news are reported by the likes of ted Jeory and gilligan I just hope normal rational people do not fall for it so easily.
This was published in TimeOut in November ’10, these smaller stickers were located around Whitechapel.
I wonder if Sultan’s English is really as bad as he/she makes out. Firstly, as far as I can make out, there have been no allegations that the writer of this piece in any way blames Lutfur Rahman or the council for homophobic/racial attacks on white people in various parts of the borough.
All that is being pointed out is that anti gay posters have started appearing in various parts of Tower Hamlets and that there have been and continue to be attacks on gay people.
What ” Sultana” seems to be saying, and it difficult to define what exactly, is that the poster campaign is in fact a false flag operation by opponents of Lutfur. The last paragraph beggars belief. Firstly David Copeland placed a bomb in The Admiral Duncan pub in Soho in 1999. He succeeded in killing several straight people including a pregnant woman.
As far as I am aware not only was there no Mayor of Tower Hamlets then but Lutfur Rahman wasn’t even a councillor so quite what all of this is about I haven’t got a clue. Could Sultana enlighten us?
The earlier generations of Bangladeshis were the targets of racist violence but ended up in alliances with progressive anti fascist whites, somthing which couldn’t happen now because of the penetration of an extremist Islamist ideology which didn’t exist thirty or so years ago.
That generation were only too aware of the participation in the genocide that was unleashed in 1971 by the Islamists of Jaamat i Islam who, along with the Bangladesh National Party, were roundly defeated in the last elections. It is ironic that Bangladeshi religious extremism flourishes in East London in a way that it doesn’t in Dhaka or Syhlet.
Quite what the point of this post is I have no idea, perhaps the write could enlighten us?
I also found the small sticker version this morning near the George Tavern, Commercial Road. As long as we don’t know who is doing this it is just speculation what the purpose of this action is and a matter for the police to investigate. I would be interested to find out what is behind this dangerous nonsense and that is why it should be on the blog and in the ELA.
Why do there seem to be only eighteen comments when at the top it says thirty three?
Because the total at the top takes into accounts replies to the numbered comments. The replies are not numbered.
Some of them are postal comments
Statement by Tower Hamlets council, Mayor Rahman and East London Mosque condemning the homophobic hate posters:
Tower Hamlets community leaders come together to condemn homophobia
Over the last weekend posters of a homophobic nature were identified and removed from four locations across the borough: The Brady Centre, Bow Church DLR, Sydney Street and Whitechapel Idea Store.
The descriptions of these posters are similar to those that have been found in 2010 in the borough, and elsewhere in South West London and Nottingham.
The posters have been reported to the Metropolitan Police, and the matter is being treated as a homophobic hate crime. All lines of enquiry are being pursued by police both within Tower Hamlets and London wide to identify and prosecute those responsible.
Following these incidents the Mayor of Tower Hamlets, alongside members of the Interfaith Forum and Rainbow Hamlets, have come together to condemn these messages of hate.
Mayor Lutfur Rahman, Chair of Tower Hamlets Partnership said:
“Tower Hamlets has a proud history of challenging prejudice and promoting equality. There is no place for hate in Tower Hamlets and we take a zero-tolerance approach to homophobia. Across all religions, partner organisations and community groups there is unanimity in the belief that by working together we can build a strong and cohesive community. There are many shared values that we can unite behind and all attempts by those at the fringes to sow the seeds of division and hatred will be rebuffed.
I have personally met with the co-chairs of Rainbow Hamlets (Tower Hamlets Lesbian Gay Bisexual and Transgender Community Forum) and am committed to working with them and the wider community to promote equality.”
Reverend Alan Green, Chair of the Tower Hamlets Inter Faith Forum said:
“People of faith in Tower Hamlets are proud to be part of this diverse and vibrant borough, in which mutual respect and tolerance are vital to social harmony. We oppose all who seek to undermine these values – homophobic hate has no place in Tower Hamlets. Whatever their backgrounds of the people they do not speak in the name of Islam, Christianity or the other religions represented here.”
Dilwar Khan, Director of the London Muslim Centre said:
“We stand together with our fellow citizens against all forms of hatred, including homophobia. We are committed to building strong and cohesive communities in Tower Hamlets, and our strength is that we will not let incidents of hate divide us.”
The Chairs of Rainbow Hamlets LGBT Community Forum said:
“We condemn such activity and call on all communities to join forces against such extreme views. We also condemn those who use these incidents to create a moral panic and stoke up racist or Islamaphobic sentiment. At present the people responsible cannot be accurately determined, but it is clear that whoever is responsible, they do not represent any of the local communities and their sole purpose is to spread fear and mistrust. This we are determined to prevent them from doing.
We welcome the repudiation of these tactics from the Tower Hamlets Inter Faith Forum, London Muslim Centre and the Mayor of Tower Hamlets. We intend to work with partners to organise an event in May to coincide with the International Day Against Homophobia, and look forward to inviting the Mayor, the Borough Commander and all communities of the borough to participate.”
If any further homophobic posters are identified by the public, they are encouraged to report them to the Metropolitan police on 0033 123 1212. If possible, please take a photograph of the poster ensuring that you record the time and location. If the poster can be removed in one piece please do so, placing it in a box with the sticky side up and if possible take to your local police station. All these measures will help police investigations.
To date there have been 10 reports of crimes in Tower Hamlets that have been identified as homophobic or transphobic this year. This compares with 74 in 2010. We actively encourage people to report all incidents of hate crime as this enables us to pursue enforcement action and bring perpetrators to justice.
February 17, 2011
It is always interesting to see what organisations actually do as opposed to what they say they do. Have a look at this link.www.hurryupharry.org/2011/02/16/the-london-muslim-centre-opposes-homophobia/
For some reason it’s not highlighted so you will have to type it in it but contains a list of extreme homphobic speakers at the East London Mosque and Islamic centre.
Perhaps Dilwar Khan should explain this at the next meeting of the hate forum. I’m sure that Rev Green will want to ask him some questions.
The figures still don’t add up. 45 and 23 posts/comments? Something wrong here. Alan Green is strangely quiet, or is it not so strange?
Replies to comments (like this one of mine) don’t show up as numbered. Add all the replies and primary comments and you get the number at the top. WordPress quirk, I’m afraid. Sorry!
Reverend Alan Green, Chair of the Tower Hamlets Inter Faith Forum said:
“People of faith in Tower Hamlets are proud to be part of this diverse and vibrant borough, in which mutual respect and tolerance are vital to social harmony. We oppose all who seek to undermine these values – homophobic hate has no place in Tower Hamlets. Whatever their backgrounds of the people they do not speak in the name of Islam, Christianity or the other religions represented here.”
Yes anon1, we know he said that. What I am interested in is his reaction, if there is going to be one, to what the preachers of hate that regularly, both in person and video link, appear at the East London Mosque and Islamic Centre.
I assume that he wouldn’t issue statements of this nature with the BNP and the EDL so why is he doing it with an organisation that hosts speakers who advocate the killing of gay people? Does anyone have an answer?
I see.
Sorry that should have ” say” at the end of the first sentence.
How can the East London Mosque still receive hand outs from the local council after it hosted a ‘spot the fag’ talk?
It’s easy, Robert. The council is run from a mosque, that’s the bad news. The even worse news is that the mosque is in Mecca and is run by some of the most racist, anti semitic and homophobic clerics in Islam and that is saying something.
LOL, sometimes it’s better to leave people to put a noose round their own necks than counter conspiracy loons
Haha! Seconded.
Steve, could you explain that one to us all? I see the Rev Green is notable by his silence. The evidence that the ELM and MC have hosted a succession of not just homophobic preachers but anti western and anti semitic as well is overwhelming.
A good exmaple of the duplicty of the ELM and MC over extremist preachers can be found by Googling Abdul Rahman al Sudais.
This man is an Immam at the Mosque of the Khabba, the holiest site of Islam in Mecca. His two faced approach, and that of the MCB is fully exposed in the post I have referred to.
What happened over the Panorama programme is typical of the like of MCB and their apologists like Rev Green. The defence of the most vile incitement to racial and religious hatred is always that of smears, inuendos and being quoted out of context
Pressed the send button while I was checking the spelling of innuendo!
What then happens is that when the evidence is presented in such a way that there is no doubt whatsoever that the words attributed to the speaker were in fact spoken then the defence of ” That’s not what he meant ” is trotted out.
This of course brings us to the conclusion that words in a final analysis have no meaning other than that which any speaker of them or their apologists wish to atribute to those words at any particular moment.
If we accept that conclusion then we have descended into an Orwellian/Kafkaesque where a word is what you want it to mean at any given moment and when later you want it mean something else then it means that as well.
Perhaps the Rev Green would like to comment on all of the evidence that has been produced that clearly shows that the ELM and MC have hosted either in person or by video link preachers of hate some of whom are banned from this and other countries.
What I, and I am sure others, would like to see is a detailed rebuttal of all of the evidence that has been produced and not just the usual platitudes about inclusiveness and diversity. Green and his interfaith forum have some explaining to do.
Someone else who will have some explaing to do will be Operation Black Vote at an up and coming trial in a Crown Court near you mentioned recently by a psot from Ted.
OBV are major supporters of the banned black racist Louis Farrakhan refused entry into this country for his anti white and anti semitic rhetoric.
When his supporters had a Hackney Council venue denied to them for a live video link up from America the current Mayor of Hackney Jules Pipe said that Farrakhan wasn’t welcome in Hackney either in person or by video. He was quoted as saying that in the Hackney Gazette.
Why is it that the Mayor of Hackney can take a principled stand against racial and religious extremism and Alan Green and his ilk can’t?
Essexlad who believes “the council is run from a mosque” sounds pretty much like that other veritable fruitcake by the name of Terry Fitzpatrick, but then maybe not.
Definately not Steve and how about dealing with what I have said. It’s all detailed and awaiting a Fisking from somebody. I take it from his silence that the Rev Green agress with what I am saying.
The things I take from his silence are:
a) He doesn’t read this blog;
b) He doesn’t care what you say/think;
c) He has better things to do than respond to a consipracy theorist on an obscure blog.
As local history seems to another topic of interest here why don’t people put ” Bangladeshi squatters in East London” into google and read the first three or four articles?
To what end?
Is anon1 the Rev Green, I think we should be told. To what end Alan? The history of the struggle, a part of which you have never been.
Ah, this is about that Walter Mittyesque fantasist Terry Fitzpatrick. History is something we learn from, but we have to live in the present. And in the present there are quite serious allegations about this man – including sending emails threatening physical violence and full of racist abuse. He has no credibility – irrespective of what he’s done in the past.
And no, I’m not Rev Green. Guess again.
Can you tell us about the allegations? With wankers like you the past has no meaning. For the rest of us does. Details please?
For a person who thinks that this is an ” obscure blog” you spend a lot of time on it. Alan, remember who tipped you off when the BNP were in your church hall and you thought they were a book club.
And jusr wehn the Rev Al thought it was safe to go back into holy water this happens. Funny stuff for a racist. But in the weird, wild wack world of the politically correct self hating whites, anything is possible.
Try googling ” The two hassans in El Aaiun” and “Tarooma and the Western Sahara”. Enjoy, Jew haters!
What’s up Ted, afraid of being sued by some one or having the race police from Limehouse coming and kicking your door in?
When they came to Terry’s house eight handed one of them had a gun. Ask Rossitor who fabricates evidence.
Court 14 tomorrow at Snarebrook, not before 11.45, to see the latest in the fit up of Terry. He will be there and will be giving a press conference in the Eagle pub over the rioad afterwards. Be there or be square. Lots of info about corrupt coppers from Limehouse.
Distinct lack of press interest yesterday but an interesting day nevertheless. First up the prosecution tried to have Terry remanded in custody. The bail conditions are that no contact is to be made with either Simon Woolley and Ashok Visnawathan and 18a Victoria Park Square is to be visited.
They claimed that email contact with other people in preparing the case constituted a breach but the judge wouldn’t have any of it.
They then produced a letter which they claimed that Terry had written recently to OBV, unfortunately for them it appeared years ago on the OBV site with Woolley claiming that it came from the far right
What Woolley has done is to dig out the old letter and then go to the police claiming that it had arrived recently from Terry. Stupid move and the judge didn’t stand for that either. It really is a sign that they are desperate.
The police have been ordered to deliver by Monday morning all of the rest of the material that they took from Terry’s study which is essential for the defence in showing that OBV is a racist and anti semitic organisation. They were ordered to do this four months ago and there have been five letters to the CPS from Terry’s solicitors.
In their defence the police claim that they ” fillet” evidence only producing what they need for a conviction. Terry isn’t confident that everything will be there but he says can retrieve most of it from other sources even if some has been destroyed.
When the house was searched photos were taken of his book case which show research on a wide range of subjects and that the owner certainly isn’t a racist. The police claim that the photos were out of focus and for that reason weren’t produced, lies of course.
The trial is scheduled to begin on the 21st of March and is listed for thee to five days. As a defence hasn’t been filed because the police haven’t complied with the court order to disclose all material this is now out of the window especially as at the moment there are sixteen defence witnesses so three weeks to a month is more likely. More info as it comes in.